Been living under a rock... Marchand C of BOS?!?

[mmkk]

OMG....

We must redeem the 2011 team and win against the RAT in the SCF. Would be poetic justice to see him cry once more but as Captain of that POS franchise.

 

LOL

[iinatcc]

Over the last couple of years I have grown to a liking of Rats.

 

Therefore I will say comparing Marchand to a Rat is offensive to Rats 

 

[Mackcanuck]

[Shekky]

ideally they get eliminated in the first round 

[Goalie29]

5 hours ago, mmkk said:

Been living under a rock... Marchand C of BOS?!?

 

Maybe you were busy with other things when they made the announcement.

 

 

[Ballisticsports]

 

It will be a playoff learning test for the Canucks

I am expecting Marchand to be goading Canucks into penalties with hits on players, slashes, words etc

Canucks need to stay focused, and 1st win the game, 2nd look for clean opportunities (without suspensions)

He knows Canuck fans want to see it and bet it bugs RT that he can't be on the ice to do it himself

He'll do something dirty to a star and expecting someone like Zads to do something and embellish and sell it

 

Btw on that evolution scale pic, I don't thing he reached the final stage, the stage before that resembles him more

[Kevin Biestra]

It would have seemed weird to see a C on the guy's jersey a decade ago but he has become a borderline Hall of Famer since then.

[Jess]

26 minutes ago, Kevin Biestra said:

It would have seemed weird to see a C on the guy's jersey a decade ago but he has become a borderline Hall of Famer since then.

 

I wouldn't go that far, but he was a superstar in his heydey. Would've easily had three or so 100+ point seasons if it weren't for shortened seasons. Needs more than the 909 points he has to get into the HHOF though. He might get to a respectable enough total by the end though to warrant consideration.

[Kevin Biestra]

7 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

I wouldn't go that far, but he was a superstar in his heydey. Would've easily had three or so 100+ point seasons if it weren't for shortened seasons. Needs more than the 909 points he has to get into the HHOF though. He might get to a respectable enough total by the end though to warrant consideration.

 

I think 1000 points and he's in.  He has been a 1st or 2nd team All Star four times now.  The only thing keeping similar guys there like Charlie Simmer and Rick Martin out was career points.

[King Heffy]

In this case, the C doesn't stand for captain.

[spook007]

5 hours ago, Mackcanuck said:

[4petesake]

4 hours ago, Shekky said:

ideally they get eliminated in the first round 

 

 

[Jester13]

2 hours ago, -AJ- said:

 

I wouldn't go that far, but he was a superstar in his heydey. Would've easily had three or so 100+ point seasons if it weren't for shortened seasons. Needs more than the 909 points he has to get into the HHOF though. He might get to a respectable enough total by the end though to warrant consideration.

He can go in Boston's Ring of Dishonour

[Hammertime]

2 hours ago, -AJ- said:

 

I wouldn't go that far, but he was a superstar in his heydey. Would've easily had three or so 100+ point seasons if it weren't for shortened seasons. Needs more than the 909 points he has to get into the HHOF though. He might get to a respectable enough total by the end though to warrant consideration.

He will absolutely be in the HHOF he has been public enemy #1 of the entire league for over a decade. There are plenty of HHOFers under 1000 pts especially with his resume and ability to change the outcome of a series. He has easily been a top 10 player in the league for over a decade. As much as I hate the rat he's had one hell of a career. 

[Coconuts]

3 hours ago, -AJ- said:

 

I wouldn't go that far, but he was a superstar in his heydey. Would've easily had three or so 100+ point seasons if it weren't for shortened seasons. Needs more than the 909 points he has to get into the HHOF though. He might get to a respectable enough total by the end though to warrant consideration.

 

He'll almost certainly be a hall of famer, he won't be a first ballot guy but he'll get in. 

 

909 career points but he's signed for next season as well, I expect he'll also sign an extension when his current deal is up. Could very well break 1k. 47 points in 50 games thus far, hard to imagine he couldn't at least be a 50 point guy for another couple seasons. 

 

3 more games and he'll be a 1k guy. 

 

Marchand doesn't have the individual hardware of a lot of the guys in the hall, but he has a cup and he's got longevity on his side. 

 

What will actually get him in is his international resume though.

 

World cup of hockey gold, world championship gold, two world junior golds, u18 gold. He may get a shot at Olympic gold yet, if the league hadn't flubbed things there's a good chance he'd already have one. 

 

It's not inconceivable that he could win a Selke too. 

 

Some Canucks fans can't let go, but Marchand has consistently won at a high level.

Edited February 7 by Coconuts

[Jess]

1 minute ago, Coconuts said:

 

He'll almost certainly be a hall of famer, he won't be a first ballot guy but he'll get in. 

 

909 career points but he's signed for next season as well, I expect he'll also sign an extension when his current deal is up. Could very well break 1k.

 

3 more games and he'll be a 1k guy. 

 

Marchand doesn't have the individual hardware of a lot of the guys in the hall, but he has a cup and he's got longevity on his side. 

 

What will actually get him in is his international resume though.

 

World cup of hockey gold, world championship gold, two world junior golds, u18 gold. He may get a shot at Olympic gold yet, if the league hadn't flubbed things there's a good chance he'd already have one. 

 

It's not inconceivable that he could win a Selke too. 

 

For me, I find that the level for most HHOF forwards is about 1100 points, though that varies a bit based on era and injuries affecting games played etc. I always felt that if it wasn't for their off-ice efforts and the novelty of being twins, the Sedins were borderline for the HHOF at just under 1100 points.

 

Marchand is still pretty effective and has another year, so he's very likely to be above 1000 points at the end of his contract. If he signs for another year or two and plays til 37 or 38, there's a good chance he finishes about 1100 points, and I'd say then he deserves to be in.

 

I don't think it's likely he wins a Selke at this point, but in his prime, he was certainly one of the best in that conversation and was probably underrated by many.

 

Looking closer at his best years, he was on pace for the following:

 

2016-17: 87 points

2017-18: 103 points

2018-19: 104 points

2019-20: 102 points

2020-21: 107 points

2021-22: 94 points

 

COVID-shortened seasons and injuries really robbed him considering he only has one actual 100+ point season. He also started a lot slower though, which is noteworthy in my mind and is why his career points-per-game isn't up to the par of a lot of other stars.

[Kevin Biestra]

5 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

 

For me, I find that the level for most HHOF forwards is about 1100 points, though that varies a bit based on era and injuries affecting games played etc. I always felt that if it wasn't for their off-ice efforts and the novelty of being twins, the Sedins were borderline for the HHOF at just under 1100 points.

 

Marchand is still pretty effective and has another year, so he's very likely to be above 1000 points at the end of his contract. If he signs for another year or two and plays til 37 or 38, there's a good chance he finishes about 1100 points, and I'd say then he deserves to be in.

 

I don't think it's likely he wins a Selke at this point, but in his prime, he was certainly one of the best in that conversation and was probably underrated by many.

 

Looking closer at his best years, he was on pace for the following:

 

2016-17: 87 points

2017-18: 103 points

2018-19: 104 points

2019-20: 102 points

2020-21: 107 points

2021-22: 94 points

 

COVID-shortened seasons and injuries really robbed him considering he only has one actual 100+ point season. He also started a lot slower though, which is noteworthy in my mind and is why his career points-per-game isn't up to the par of a lot of other stars.

 

Without looking it up, I would be willing to bet that Marchand would be the only player in NHL history to be a post season All Star four times and have 1000 points and not be in the Hall of Fame.

[canuck73_3]

3 hours ago, -AJ- said:

 

I wouldn't go that far, but he was a superstar in his heydey. Would've easily had three or so 100+ point seasons if it weren't for shortened seasons. Needs more than the 909 points he has to get into the HHOF though. He might get to a respectable enough total by the end though to warrant consideration.

He'll be a hall of Famer imo, Team Canada success and a cup boost him in for sure. 

[Coconuts]

5 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

 

For me, I find that the level for most HHOF forwards is about 1100 points, though that varies a bit based on era and injuries affecting games played etc. I always felt that if it wasn't for their off-ice efforts and the novelty of being twins, the Sedins were borderline for the HHOF at just under 1100 points.

 

Marchand is still pretty effective and has another year, so he's very likely to be above 1000 points at the end of his contract. If he signs for another year or two and plays til 37 or 38, there's a good chance he finishes about 1100 points, and I'd say then he deserves to be in.

 

I don't think it's likely he wins a Selke at this point, but in his prime, he was certainly one of the best in that conversation and was probably underrated by many.

 

Looking closer at his best years, he was on pace for the following:

 

2016-17: 87 points

2017-18: 103 points

2018-19: 104 points

2019-20: 102 points

2020-21: 107 points

2021-22: 94 points

 

COVID-shortened seasons and injuries really robbed him considering he only has one actual 100+ point season. He also started a lot slower though, which is noteworthy in my mind and is why his career points-per-game isn't up to the par of a lot of other stars.

 

I don't think HOF standards are perhaps what they once were, point totals dipped for a while but we've seen an uptick in offense in recent years. By more modern standards I think he gets in. 

 

I think he'll absolutely hit 1k, he'd have to fall off a cliff or not play beyond next season not to. 47 points in 50 games thus far, he's still very productive. I'd be surprised if he doesn't play beyond next season. If he plays beyond next season he could get closer to 1.1k, it really depends on how long he wants to play. He's still a very effective two-way player and Boston will likely keep him around as long as he wants to play. 

 

COVID robbed him though, absolutely. 

 

As for the Selke, dunno, it's a wide open race this season with Bergeron gone and he could be in the mix. He's almost point per game and could get reputation votes. Barkov is also in that camp. But even without one he'd probably get in.

 

As I said before, I think his international success gets him over the hump. If he didn't have a cup he may not get in, but he has one. International success is a big one 

[Jess]

4 minutes ago, Kevin Biestra said:

 

Without looking it up, I would be willing to bet that Marchand would be the only player in NHL history to be a post season All Star four times and have 1000 points and not be in the Hall of Fame.

 

Yeah, I guess I don't put too much stock into making All-Star Teams a few times. Long-term success is more important to me and Marchand was a middle six forward for the first seven years of his career. Had he been a top line forward right out of the gate, I'd agree. It's the same thing that held back the numbers of the Sedins.

 

I will concede that playoff success is maybe something I'm not giving enough credit. 128 playoff points in 146 games is nothing to shake a stick at.

[Jess]

Just now, Coconuts said:

 

I don't think HOF standards are perhaps what they once were, point totals dipped for a while but we've seen an uptick in offense in recent years. By more modern standards I think he gets in. 

 

I think he'll absolutely hit 1k, he'd have to fall off a cliff or not play beyond next season not to. 47 points in 50 games thus far, he's still very productive. I'd be surprised if he doesn't play beyond next season. If he plays beyond next season he could get closer to 1.1k, it really depends on how long he wants to play. He's still a very effective two-way player and Boston will likely keep him around as long as he wants to play. 

 

COVID robbed him though, absolutely. 

 

As for the Selke, dunno, it's a wide open race this season with Bergeron gone and he could be in the mix. He's almost point per game and could get reputation votes. Barkov is also in that camp. But even without one he'd probably get in.

 

As I said before, I think his international success gets him over the hump. If he didn't have a cup he may not get in, but he has one. International success is a big one 

 

A lot of players can drop off very suddenly as they hit 35, 36, or 37, so we'll see if he keeps it up, but for now, he's still very good.

 

In the end, it may just be a moot point if he finishes with 1150 points or something, at which point, we all agree he's a HHOFer.

[canuck73_3]

35 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

 

Yeah, I guess I don't put too much stock into making All-Star Teams a few times. Long-term success is more important to me and Marchand was a middle six forward for the first seven years of his career. Had he been a top line forward right out of the gate, I'd agree. It's the same thing that held back the numbers of the Sedins.

 

I will concede that playoff success is maybe something I'm not giving enough credit. 128 playoff points in 146 games is nothing to shake a stick at.

The 1st and 2nd Team All Star awards hold much more weight than All Star Games, means you were consistently an impact player all season. 

[Jess]

4 minutes ago, canuck73_3 said:

The 1st and 2nd Team All Star awards hold much more weight than All Star Games, means you were consistently an impact player all season. 

 

I'd strongly agree with that--I give almost no value to the ASG nominations. I just look for more long-term success than three or four 1st or 2nd All Star team nominations. Those are good, but in Marchand's case, outside of most of those years, he wasn't a 1st line forward.

[Kevin Biestra]

1 hour ago, -AJ- said:

 

I'd strongly agree with that--I give almost no value to the ASG nominations. I just look for more long-term success than three or four 1st or 2nd All Star team nominations. Those are good, but in Marchand's case, outside of most of those years, he wasn't a 1st line forward.

 

I didn't say All Star Game.  I said first and second post-season All Star Team.  As in the best two players in the league at each position.

 

Very few players ever get four berths on the post-season All Star Teams.  Like I said...I think Marchand if he doesn't make the HOF would be the first ever to have that and 1000 points and not get in.  Rick Martin had four but his body burned out at 700 points and that's the only reason he's not in the Hall.

 

Many Hall of Famers are only a post-season All Star once ever.  Luongo, Henrik and Daniel all had only two each, and were in on the first ballot.  Peter Stastny never had one and he is a legend.

 

[Jess]

Just now, Kevin Biestra said:

 

I didn't say All Star Game.  I said first and second post-season All Star Team.  As in the best two players in the league at each position.

 

Very few players ever get four berths on the post-season All Star Teams.  Like I said...I think Marchand if he doesn't make the HOF would be the first ever to have that and 1000 points and not get in.  Rick Martin had four but his body burned out at 700 points and that's the only reason he's not in the Hall.

 

Many Hall of Famers are only a post-season All Star once ever.  Luongo, Henrik and Daniel all had only two each, and were in on the first ballot.  Peter Stastny never had one and he is a legend.

 

 

Yeah, I wasn't responding to your post, so I understood that you meant All-Star Team. It's noteworthy that Marchand is a LW which traditionally has weaker players, so it's easier to get nominated there. Other positions are harder to get nominated for, hence why guys like Stastny (a centre) didn't get in despite obviously being far superior to a guy like Marchand. Luongo is another case just like Stastny. I've already stated that I think that based on stats alone, the Twins were borderline HHOFers and not shoe-in candidates. They got in first ballot due to their incredible off-ice work and I also believe the novelty of being twins aided them in getting in so quickly.