Rocket-68 Posted January 23 Share Posted January 23 (edited) Bored, waiting for a meeting to start so here goes. This is on the back of a comment made by the know-it-all Friedman who mused (paraphrasing), "Toronto may be looking beyond this season and retooling for a serious run next year. This means building around Nylander and Matthews." Really Elliot, so Marner and Tavares are in play or at least open for discussion? The former I highly doubt but the latter, at 33, maybe. So a deal would be: To Toronto: Kuzmenko 1st in 2024 or 2025, conditional To intermediate team: Tavares with TO retaining a third Toronto's 2nd in 2024 OR Toronto's 3rd and 5th in 2023 and 2024 or flip them To Vancouver: Tavares with intermediate team retaining a 1/3 Would you do it? Does TO say no? Too rich a price paid by Vancouver? Is Elliot on crack? Edited January 23 by Rocket-68 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post PhillipBlunt Posted January 23 Popular Post Share Posted January 23 Tavares is past his prime and ineffective. He's not worth wasting anything on. Let Toronto continue to choke on that mistake. 1 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket-68 Posted January 23 Author Share Posted January 23 (edited) 9 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: Tavares is past his prime and ineffective. He's not worth wasting anything on. Let Toronto continue to choke on that mistake. Yes agreed, Tavares is not 27 years old but last season was a point a game player and this season not that far off that pace. I guess the question really is, assuming Tavares would even move or be moved, is does he bring value and make Vancouver a much better team this year after the smoke clears. I think so but is the price too much assume the deal above is actually accomplished ... again I think so, but hard to quantify what "much better team" means. Edited January 23 by Rocket-68 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted January 23 Share Posted January 23 2 minutes ago, Rocket-68 said: Yes agreed, Tavares is not 27 years old but last season was a point a game player and this season not that far off that pace. I guess the question really is, assuming Tavares would even move or be moved, is does he bring value and make Vancouver a much better team this year after the smoke clears. I think so but is the price too much assume the deal above is actually accomplished ... again I think so, but hard to quantify what "much better team" means. I think he could provide some value as a second line center, but he seemed soft and ineffective in the game against Vancouver. The Canucks have struck a fine balance with chemistry right now and have a clear identity. Not sure Tavares would be capable of fitting in to that. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pears Posted January 23 Share Posted January 23 I'd 100% go for Marner if that's true. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted January 23 Share Posted January 23 2 hours ago, Rocket-68 said: Bored, waiting for a meeting to start so here goes. This is on the back of a comment made by the know-it-all Friedman who mused (paraphrasing), "Toronto may be looking beyond this season and retooling for a serious run next year. This means building around Nylander and Matthews." Really Elliot, so Marner and Tavares are in play or at least open for discussion? The former I highly doubt but the latter, at 33, maybe. So a deal would be: To Toronto: Kuzmenko 1st in 2024 or 2025, conditional To intermediate team: Tavares with TO retaining a third Toronto's 2nd in 2024 OR Toronto's 3rd and 5th in 2023 and 2024 or flip them To Vancouver: Tavares with intermediate team retaining a 1/3 Would you do it? Does TO say no? Too rich a price paid by Vancouver? Is Elliot on crack? Tavares says no; he has a NMC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasCanuck Posted January 23 Share Posted January 23 2 hours ago, Rocket-68 said: Bored, waiting for a meeting to start so here goes. This is on the back of a comment made by the know-it-all Friedman who mused (paraphrasing), "Toronto may be looking beyond this season and retooling for a serious run next year. This means building around Nylander and Matthews." Really Elliot, so Marner and Tavares are in play or at least open for discussion? The former I highly doubt but the latter, at 33, maybe. So a deal would be: To Toronto: Kuzmenko 1st in 2024 or 2025, conditional To intermediate team: Tavares with TO retaining a third Toronto's 2nd in 2024 OR Toronto's 3rd and 5th in 2023 and 2024 or flip them To Vancouver: Tavares with intermediate team retaining a 1/3 Would you do it? Does TO say no? Too rich a price paid by Vancouver? Is Elliot on crack? So, first opinion, NO, I wouldn't do this, not as it's laid out at least. Canucks couldn't make this work on face value either, we can't afford 2/3rd's of Tavares's contract even with moving Kuzmenko. Now, Toronto, in my opinion, badly needs to move Tavares, his contract is preventing them from making other moves and he's really not worth 11 million per season anymore making his contract immovable unless they are adding. If this was: To Vancouver: Tavares with 50% retained 2025 3rd round pick To Toronto: Kuzmenko 2025 5th round pick That, I might do as Tavares is a better overall player than Kuzmenko, but Kuzmenko is a more movable contract. Toronto could move Kuzmenko somewhere else to recover picks and other assets. Both teams, "might" consider this type of move, but I doubt that Tavares would waive his NMC to leave Toronto. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket-68 Posted January 24 Author Share Posted January 24 48 minutes ago, Alflives said: Tavares says no; he has a NMC. While not an option as his waiving is implied, but still thank you for playing. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket-68 Posted January 24 Author Share Posted January 24 (edited) 40 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said: So, first opinion, NO, I wouldn't do this, not as it's laid out at least. Canucks couldn't make this work on face value either, we can't afford 2/3rd's of Tavares's contract even with moving Kuzmenko. Now, Toronto, in my opinion, badly needs to move Tavares, his contract is preventing them from making other moves and he's really not worth 11 million per season anymore making his contract immovable unless they are adding. If this was: To Vancouver: Tavares with 50% retained 2025 3rd round pick To Toronto: Kuzmenko 2025 5th round pick That, I might do as Tavares is a better overall player than Kuzmenko, but Kuzmenko is a more movable contract. Toronto could move Kuzmenko somewhere else to recover picks and other assets. Both teams, "might" consider this type of move, but I doubt that Tavares would waive his NMC to leave Toronto. Thank you for your input, the hypothetical deal above results in 67% of Tavares contract retained once he lands, to @Alflives, having waived his NMC, or put another way, Vancouver is paying 1/3 of his current salary this year and next. Kuzy's cap more than covers that. Edited January 24 by Rocket-68 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Arrogant Worms Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 No to helping Toronto. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grumpyone Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 NO I wouldn't trade or Tavares if the Leafs with held 100% of his salary. He's so far over the hill it isn't funny. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil_314 Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 I'd only go for Bertuzzi, or perhaps Holmberg if they're done putting him with Matthews and Marner. Pontus has shown that he can stick with star players in streaks. Doubt they'd let Tavares go, and he still might cost lots. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasCanuck Posted January 24 Share Posted January 24 17 hours ago, Rocket-68 said: Thank you for your input, the hypothetical deal above results in 67% of Tavares contract retained once he lands, to @Alflives, having waived his NMC, or put another way, Vancouver is paying 1/3 of his current salary this year and next. Kuzy's cap more than covers that. Okay, then you need to involve another team because the maximum that any one team can retain is 50% from what I understand in the CBA. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rocket-68 Posted January 24 Author Share Posted January 24 (edited) 22 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said: Okay, then you need to involve another team because the maximum that any one team can retain is 50% from what I understand in the CBA. That is the middle section "the intermediate team". Yes, CBA dictates that no more than 50% of salary including signing bonuses, can be retained during a transaction. There is no limit on the number of teams that can be involved in retaining. Below is one example I came across with a quick search but there are more recent ones involving Arizona and CBJ if memory serves me correctly. Jan 15, 2014: Dubnyk was traded from Edmonton to Nashville. Edmonton retained 50% of his salary, or $1.75M of the $3.5M total. March 5, 2014: Dubnyk was traded from Nashville to Montreal. Nashville retained 25% of his salary (which applies to the original total). Therefore, the Predators retained $0.875M. March 5, 2014: Dubnyk was immediately demoted to Montreal’s AHL affiliate in Hamilton. After the demotion, he didn’t count against Montreal’s cap but he did still count against Edmonton’s ($1.75M) and Nashville’s ($0.875M). Edited January 24 by Rocket-68 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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