Ricky Ravioli Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 2 minutes ago, 6of1_halfdozenofother said: Well, I mean, with a logic of "anything is worth a shot over Trudeau", I'm surprised the poster masquerading as some kinda pasta (fantastic restaurant in point grey that was, while it was still there... but I digress) hasn't decided to fall in line behind the NDP. Or even the Greens. Ou le Bloc Quebecois. Those are also part of "anything", and they have the benefit of not having the damning track record of what the current Official Opposition did while in power. The NDP who is currently propping up the liberal government I want gone? I ask how that would make much sense for me Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 1 minute ago, Ricky Ravioli said: I love this "sHoW mE hOw ThEy WiLl Be BeTtEr" Like I'm not running for prime minister. It isn't my job to show you anything. All I can do is share my opinion and why I feel that way Well the guy you're telling us to vote for is doing a pretty shit job of it himself, so why EXACTLY are you voting for him? Why should we? Please tell me you have more than "not Trudeau". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 12 minutes ago, Ricky Ravioli said: I'm curious why you think the liberal party is polling sooo badly right now. If they are keeping promises and all that? Honestly I don't even know if PP will be better. What I know is after 9 years, anything is worth a shot over Trudeau Also what history? And define "worse" because I'm assuming that just means policies you don't like That's easy, people get tired of leaders in Canada after 10 years. And yes people are still mad post covid. None of that makes PP a good or better choice. In fact his recent foray into social issues shows how bad of a choice he is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 2 minutes ago, Ricky Ravioli said: The NDP who is currently propping up the liberal government I want gone? I ask how that would make much sense for me For all their flaws (and there certainly are many)...they're pro-union/worker, they actually create policy that helps actual Canadians like healthcare, pharmacare, dental etc, etc 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 34 minutes ago, aGENT said: Because they're mad (AKA emotional @Elias Pettersson) and naive having never worked/elected/lived as adults under a Conservative government to know the realities of what that means (slashed social safety nets, slashed public services, anti-union/worker, selling off Canadian assets to foreign entities, climate change denial etc, etc). And heck, I'm not even saying they shouldn't be mad. Boomers gamed the system, outnumber them (aging population), handed over too much power to corporations, and did it all while pillaging the planet causing climate change that's going to cost them billions of dollars, hardship and massive changes in their lifestyles. The same lifestyles those Boomers enjoyed. And those Boomers now need to be cared for in their twilight years, costing even more money. And on top of that, they had to go through a global pandemic, a couple of absoluuetly stupid wars etc, with all the inflation and myriad other issues they've caused. They should be pissed. Leaning even further in to those issues by voting for the Cons, hardly seems a reasoned, rational response. Voting for the same party who hasn't helped them in any way is also not very rational and reasoned. Hence, why young voters are turning to the Conservatives. The rest of your post is just fear mongering. It's not going to work this time around. Canadians have had enough and want change... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said: Voting for the same party who hasn't helped them in any way is also not very rational and reasoned. Hence, why young voters are turning to the Conservatives. The rest of your post is just fear mongering. It's not going to work this time around. Canadians have had enough and want change... Voting for a party who is actively trying to harm them is not a positive change. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Ravioli Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 4 minutes ago, aGENT said: Well the guy you're telling us to vote for is doing a pretty shit job of it himself, so why EXACTLY are you voting for him? Why should we? Please tell me you have more than "not Trudeau". Show me where I have ever told anyone to vote for anybody. I don't care who you vote for. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 (edited) 7 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: Voting for the same party who hasn't helped them in any way is also not very rational and reasoned. Hence, why young voters are turning to the Conservatives. The rest of your post is just fear mongering. It's not going to work this time around. Canadians have had enough and want change... By all means, vote elsewhere. I've been suggesting it for years. If nothing else but to get our two main parties that we like to yo-yo between to smarten the fuck up and govern better. Neither party has particularly served us all that well, the Cons are just the worst of the two. Bad and badder. Voting for a party that's even worse is hardly reasoned or rational. Voting for the two same parties that got us here, and that we've been electing for DECADES isn't "change". It's more of exactly the same, and the worse of them. Edited May 14 by aGENT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 2 minutes ago, Ricky Ravioli said: Show me where I have ever told anyone to vote for anybody. I don't care who you vote for. Please don't tell me to vote for PP. Also, you better damn well vote for Trudeau again or society is fucked... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 2 minutes ago, Ricky Ravioli said: Show me where I have ever told anyone to vote for anybody. I don't care who you vote for. Sure...how about "promoting here and suggesting you will vote for"? Better? Now how about actually addressing the actual meat of the post? So why EXACTLY are you voting for him? Why should we? Please tell me you have more than "not Trudeau". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 2 minutes ago, aGENT said: By all means, vote elsewhere. I've been suggesting it for years. If nothing else but to get our two main parties that we like to yo-yo between to smarten the fuck up and govern better. Neither party has particularly served us all that well, the Cons are just the worst of the two. Bad and badder. Voting for a party that's even worse is hardly reasoned or rational. Voting for the two same parties that got us and that we've been electing for DECADES isn't "change". It's more of exactly the same, and the worse of them. That is strictly your opinion. It could be true, or it could not be true. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. Not everyone agrees with yours... 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 7 minutes ago, King Heffy said: Voting for a party who is actively trying to harm them is not a positive change. They have already been harmed by the current party... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 1 minute ago, Elias Pettersson said: That is strictly your opinion. It could be true, or it could not be true. Everyone is entitled to an opinion. Not everyone agrees with yours... Nope, it's pretty factual in their history. Canadians and Canada do worse under the Conservatives. Fiscally, socially, environmentally. Cuts to social safety nets, pro corporations over people, worse environmental policies, worse public infrastructure, wage disparity etc, etc. 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Ravioli Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 12 minutes ago, aGENT said: Sure...how about "promoting here and suggesting you will vote for"? Better? Now how about actually addressing the actual meat of the post? So why EXACTLY are you voting for him? Why should we? Please tell me you have more than "not Trudeau". You are free to read my post history if you are looking for that information. I'm not going to repeat myself each time I'm asked that question Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 9 minutes ago, aGENT said: Nope, it's pretty factual in their history. Canadians and Canada do worse under the Conservatives. Fiscally, socially, environmentally. Cuts to social safety nets, pro corporations over people, worse environmental policies, worse public infrastructure, wage disparity etc, etc. We have to be a bit more accurate, many of those got better under Mulroney. But the current CPC is a long way from that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 (edited) 54 minutes ago, aGENT said: Nope, it's pretty factual in their history. Canadians and Canada do worse under the Conservatives. Fiscally, socially, environmentally. Cuts to social safety nets, pro corporations over people, worse environmental policies, worse public infrastructure, wage disparity etc, etc. This is actually very far from facts, this country has been on a steady decline since 2005. https://cheung.artsci.utoronto.ca/wp-content/uploads/2022/03/Canadian-Happiness-Report-March-2022.pdf Overall, our analysis found that Canadian well-being has been decreasing since the late 2000s. Although Canada finds itself at the top of most happiness charts, this downturn in well-being is cause for concern and greater involvement from policymakers. Given our findings, we think it is important for the Canadian government to gain a more in-depth understanding of changes to population well-being by monitoring SWB trends in the population. This monitoring can serve as a type of pacemaker which alerts the public when levels of well-being are low or dropping. Conversely, it can also monitor if certain policy implementations have had a significant impact on the Canadian population. Edited May 14 by Bure_Pavel 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 54 minutes ago, aGENT said: Nope, it's pretty factual in their history. Canadians and Canada do worse under the Conservatives. Fiscally, socially, environmentally. Cuts to social safety nets, pro corporations over people, worse environmental policies, worse public infrastructure, wage disparity etc, etc. Well I think you are gonna need to provide all of those “facts” to prove your points. I mean Jimmy even disagrees with you. Point by point, how are we better under the Liberals than under the Conservatives in every issue you brought up? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bure_Pavel Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 12 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said: Well I think you are gonna need to provide all of those “facts” to prove your points. I mean Jimmy even disagrees with you. Point by point, how are we better under the Liberals than under the Conservatives in every issue you brought up? From What I can see GDP when Harper was PM increased from 1.319 Trillion in 2006 in to 1.806 Trillion in 2014, While Trudeau was PM it went from 1.806 Trillion in 2014 to 1.927 Trillion in 2023 even with a major major increase in government spending. Not to mention Canada won the winter Olympics in 2010. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapper Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 In the what's new today from the PP fan club ... Axe the tax protest media As normal calls to criminalize involvement in or running for any positions in any liberal or NDP party in canada A few that are starting to form a distinct pattern showing loss of reality 1 - apparently Alberta NDP and Truduea let fort Mac burn back in 2016 and refused to allow anyone but union fire fighters. They didn't like it when someone posted up an old news quote from. Danielle Smith herself saying she disagrees with most everything NDP but praised Notley for how that fire was handled 2 - Justin has bought a place in Costa Rica they say which has no extradition treaty with Canada so that's proof he is about to flee the country if we don't arrest him soon 3 - again blaming Truduea for air spraying some chemical that disperses clouds to prevent rain ... Thus causing the droughts that caused the fires Kidding aside ( and they make laughing at them just too easy )... Im really starting to feel that conservatism should be tagged with a mental health warning There thoughts have been compromised, are irrational and are disengaged from reality. Unlike plain old conspiracy believers this is pointing to a deeper mental health problem This is why people are so critical of PP .... He is knowingly telling people their fears.and thoughts are real ....validating it for them. This is why some predominant conservatives spoke out about feeding the fire ( Kenney , Mulroney , O'Toole ). PP is messing with fire and it's not going to end peacefully I fear 1 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spring Salmon Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 5 hours ago, aGENT said: I don't particularly like Trudeau. That said, I don't really care about it him all that much either. This has nothing to do with Trudeau. Frankly leadership doesn't really matter all that much. They're just the face of a party unless you're actually in their riding. You know what I do like and care about? Policies. Voting for the Cons is voting against the vast majority of Canadian's own best interests. Even though I don't like JT(I sure don't) that's not the reason I'm not voting for him. His policies are. Voting for him would be voting against my own best interests. You may still think he's the best choice, and that's your right, go vote for him but the vast majority of Canadians don't anymore. He's been leader for 9 years and doesn't have much to show for it besides legalizing weed, and even for that you could argue it wasn't done properly. I know some of you don't want PP to be PM but that's life in a democracy. I sure didn't want this liberal/NDP government for the last 9 years either. After all this time it's clear we won't be changing anyone's mind on here so you got one vote and so do I. Let's let the people decide, sooner than later hopefully Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4petesake Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 4 hours ago, Bob Long said: But Ricky, nothing you've posted shows pp would better , and CPC history shows it will likely get worse. If 14,000 is a literal drop in the bucket and PP is going to “axe the tax”, reduce taxes, build up infrastructure, all while balancing the budget; how many new daycare spots will the CPC be able to open up to help young Canadians? Seriously if I thought he could do all that and stay away from the rage-farming and social conservative bullshit I’d vote for him. Showing me a “plan” that’s nothing more than a wish list is a lot like a retirement plan that revolves around buying lottery tickets. 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spring Salmon Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 25 minutes ago, Sapper said: . Im really starting to feel that conservatism should be tagged with a mental health warning Are you serious? This is just pathetic 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sapper Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 12 minutes ago, Spring Salmon said: Are you serious? This is just pathetic Dead serious They are feeding into delusional beliefs and feeding falsehoods so extreme that it can't be rationalized as legitimate or believable Telling people that the "voices are real" is dangerous and falsely validates their beliefs. This is going way beyond just hating the other guy and despising a party. It's not the person PP or the party ... It's the conservative movement that is feeding the delusions We have no issues calling antifa an extremely fringe group .... This conservative movement is to normal conservative principals what antifi is to the left wing Both are wrong and both feed if the easy prey of people looking to fit in 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 20 minutes ago, Spring Salmon said: Are you serious? This is just pathetic Some of the culture war stuff is pretty bad, surely you'd agree there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ricky Ravioli Posted May 14 Share Posted May 14 23 minutes ago, 4petesake said: If 14,000 is a literal drop in the bucket and PP is going to “axe the tax”, reduce taxes, build up infrastructure, all while balancing the budget; how many new daycare spots will the CPC be able to open up to help young Canadians? Seriously if I thought he could do all that and stay away from the rage-farming and social conservative bullshit I’d vote for him. Showing me a “plan” that’s nothing more than a wish list is a lot like a retirement plan that revolves around buying lottery tickets. After doing some quick googling, it's my understanding that it's the provincial governments who are mainly responsible for childcare, so maybe that's a question for the NDP and not PP? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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