Dakota Joshua | #81 | C/W

[Coconuts]

22 hours ago, HKSR said:

I don't think he has the ceiling of a Tuch.  I'm thinking more along the lines of Nic Roy or Nick Paul. 

 

Probably not. We're not talking young player here, Joshua will be 28 in May and most players are what they are by that point. More than likely the best case scenario is Joshua continuing to simply be what he has been this season. 

 

Tuch will also be 28 in May, but if one looks at five of his past six seasons it's quite obvious he's got a much better track record of producing. As a young player no less. 

 

More than likely what we have seen this season is Joshua's ceiling unless one envisions him as a top six player instead of a third liner, which I don't. Their pedigree is also different, with Joshua having been drafted in the 5th round whereas Tuch was drafted 18OA. 

[-AJ-]

Just now, Coconuts said:

 

Probably not. We're not talking young player here, Joshua will be 28 in May and most players are what they are by that point. More than likely the best case scenario is Joshua continuing to simply be what he has been this season. 

 

Tuch will also be 28 in May, but if one looks at five of his past six seasons it's quite obvious he's got a much better track record of producing. As a young player no less. 

 

More than likely what we have seen this season is Joshua's ceiling unless one envisions him as a top six player instead of a third liner, which I don't. Their pedigree is also different, with Joshua having been drafted in the 5th round whereas Tuch was drafted 18OA. 

 

For sure. The one caveat I would give is Miller, who, at 31, seems to be the best he's ever been. The Sedins were that way too, but those do seem to be exceptions to the rule. Joshua is probably a 3rd liner who maybe has space to be called a middle six forward at his best, and that's damn good given that he was pretty much a 13th forward when he arrived here.

[Coconuts]

1 minute ago, -AJ- said:

 

For sure. The one caveat I would give is Miller, who, at 31, seems to be the best he's ever been. The Sedins were that way too, but those do seem to be exceptions to the rule. Joshua is probably a 3rd liner who maybe has space to be called a middle six forward at his best, and that's damn good given that he was pretty much a 13th forward when he arrived here.

 

I'm not really a fan of Miller as a person, but he always had the pedigree to potentially have more in the tank as a 15OA pick. His fourth season had him put up 43 in 82, his fifth season had him put up 56 in 82. He had three 40+ seasons and one 50+ point season prior to being traded the Vancouver. Maybe he'd have thrived sooner if he'd stuck with the Rangers, but he was stuck on a deep Tampa team when we acquired him. 

 

Miller leveled up as a Canuck, but it didn't come out of nowhere. The twins always had the pedigree too as top five picks, they just took a bit longer to get going but it's not as if Canucks fans couldn't see that they were special. Every once in a while players will kinda come out of nowhere and it's as if they just suddenly decide they're good, but most of the time players generally are what they are by their later 20's. 

 

But for sure, I'm not discounting his value, I just don't projecting him as a Tuch level player is realistic given they're the same age. If he were doing what he's done this season at say.. 22, maybe, but he's gonna be 28. At best Joshua's maybe a Tuch-lite middle six forward, as you've said. But that's not nothing, he's found money at this point. It's just a matter of what he ends up being paid and by whom. 

 

Sounds like he's going to be a priority for management, but he may have to take less than he could get elsewhere to stay and maybe he'll do just that. 

[-AJ-]

5 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

But for sure, I'm not discounting his value, I just don't projecting him as a Tuch level player is realistic given they're the same age. If he were doing what he's done this season at say.. 22, maybe, but he's gonna be 28. At best Joshua's maybe a Tuch-lite middle six forward, as you've said. But that's not nothing, he's found money at this point. It's just a matter of what he ends up being paid and by whom. 

 

Sounds like he's going to be a priority for management, but he may have to take less than he could get elsewhere to stay and maybe he'll do just that. 

 

Yeah, Tuch and Joshua are definitely not apples to apples players. I don't think Joshua will ever be a point a game nor close to that level. I still do think that although he won't be the same level as Miller or the twins, he could still hit a peak at 30 or 31 that is maybe a 2nd line guy for a year or two scoring 25 goals and 55-60 points or something; however, I wouldn't predict that. He's a 40-point guy right now and like you, I suspect the 35-45-point range is probably where he'll stay for the next three or four years.

[Wilbur]

Joshua hits 155th in all-time Canuck scoring with his goal last night.

 

154	Kyle Wellwood	C	149	32	20	52
155	Dakota Joshua	C	137	27	25	52
156	Adam Gaudette	C	153	21	31	52
157	Dave Capuano	C	88	16	36	52
158	David Booth	LW	134	26	25	51

[flat land fish]

On 4/4/2024 at 4:09 PM, -AJ- said:

 

Yeah, Tuch and Joshua are definitely not apples to apples players. I don't think Joshua will ever be a point a game nor close to that level. I still do think that although he won't be the same level as Miller or the twins, he could still hit a peak at 30 or 31 that is maybe a 2nd line guy for a year or two scoring 25 goals and 55-60 points or something; however, I wouldn't predict that. He's a 40-point guy right now and like you, I suspect the 35-45-point range is probably where he'll stay for the next three or four years.

What sort of cap hit will that drive at UFA?

[Gurn]

While I like Joshua a lot, I hope he, and his agent, don't think his shooting percentage and goal scoring are going to remain high.

I'd  try to sign him, for a bit more money, but not a lot more money.

 

Last guy that got signed by the Nucks, with a wacky shooting %;  didn't make it through the next season, with the team.

Edited May 18 by Gurn

[kettlevalley]

I could see Joshua getting shots in the top 6 next year and what he brings is not so much goal scoring.  I don't have an issue at 3m for a top 6/top 9 play driver.  And I think 2.5m is more what he would be happy with if he gets a 3 year deal @ 7.5m. That makes good sense.  

[syntheticity]

I'm not sure if this has been shared already but promising update from his agent:

 

 

Edited May 26 by syntheticity

[Rip The Mesh]

There could be a scenario where there just isn't enough cap space for everyone to come back;

 

The 6-foot-3, 206-pound Joshua hit career highs for goals (18) and points (32) in 63 games with a willingness to get to the net and show off some soft hands. He led the club in regular season hits (244) — which ranked ninth overall in the league — and also led the Canucks in the postseason (74). 

Joshua, 28, was a key cog in a vastly improved penalty kill that went from embarrassing to effective. It had 79.1-per-cent efficiency in the regular season and 81 per cent in the postseason. It was dead last in 2023-24 at 71.6 per cent.

And most importantly, he measured up in the playoffs with eight points (4-4) in 13 games. So, what’s not to like?

[Sativika]

I know there's cap issues and such, but in my mind we really oughta' sign him. a project player that worked out and then some. Loyal to the team and wants to win here. Let's make it happen!

[kettlevalley]

Honestly thought Allvin would be making better headway on getting some targets signed.  

 

[-AJ-]

Just now, kettlevalley said:

Honestly thought Allvin would be making better headway on getting some targets signed.  

 

 

Far to early I think to worry about this. I expect most signings to be in June.

[kettlevalley]

17 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

 

Far to early I think to worry about this. I expect most signings to be in June.

Awful lot of work to do to know get on it as soon as you can.  

[-AJ-]

4 minutes ago, kettlevalley said:

Awful lot of work to do to know get on it as soon as you can.  

 

There have been zero signings of $3M or more in the month of May by any NHL team. No one is signing contracts right now. It's very normal not to sign contracts during April and May. Expect a ton in June.

[Warhippy]

If he moves on.  Who is the replacement?

 

I pose Reid Schaefer now Predators property.  Unsure what the value would be but he looks promising.

[DownUndaCanuck]

Looking around the league 2.5-3M seems to be fair but those were on deals signed a while ago so I wonder if we'd be pushing 3M or higher. Some team will offer 3.5M easily and that's starting to get a bit pricey, especially when we have to consider signing a center to play with him and Garland too. I don't think Blueger was particularly amazing in the post-season so wonder if we can somehow get the pair for 5M and run with it?

[Alflives]

5 minutes ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

Looking around the league 2.5-3M seems to be fair but those were on deals signed a while ago so I wonder if we'd be pushing 3M or higher. Some team will offer 3.5M easily and that's starting to get a bit pricey, especially when we have to consider signing a center to play with him and Garland too. I don't think Blueger was particularly amazing in the post-season so wonder if we can somehow get the pair for 5M and run with it?

We need to trade Garland. Then we can sign Joshua. 

[DownUndaCanuck]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

We need to trade Garland. Then we can sign Joshua. 

 

I like to think if we keep them both, they're like a superstar. 20G for Garland and say 25G for Joshua next year isn't out of the realm of possibility. They could combine for 45G and 90-100 points easily. Plus, they kill penalties and play great forechecking.

 

You'd give a 45G 100pt scoring forward like 10-12M easily, so I don't mind Garland at 5M and Joshua at say 3-4M.

[Alflives]

7 minutes ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

 

I like to think if we keep them both, they're like a superstar. 20G for Garland and say 25G for Joshua next year isn't out of the realm of possibility. They could combine for 45G and 90-100 points easily. Plus, they kill penalties and play great forechecking.

 

You'd give a 45G 100pt scoring forward like 10-12M easily, so I don't mind Garland at 5M and Joshua at say 3-4M.

Joshua plays pk minutes. Garland is okay 5 on 5 but only against bottom six forwards and bottom pairing D. He’s small and slow. He can’t play against top players. Joshua can. 
Keep Joshua and move out all of Garlsnd’s cap. 

[DownUndaCanuck]

9 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Joshua plays pk minutes. Garland is okay 5 on 5 but only against bottom six forwards and bottom pairing D. He’s small and slow. He can’t play against top players. Joshua can. 
Keep Joshua and move out all of Garlsnd’s cap. 

 

Crazy idea - let Joshua walk, flip Garland and Mikheyev or buy one out (going to cost us a few picks there).

Sign Lindholm 7M and one of DeBrusk, Roslovic or Toffoli (5M)

 

 

[Alflives]

38 minutes ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

 

Crazy idea - let Joshua walk, flip Garland and Mikheyev or buy one out (going to cost us a few picks there).

Sign Lindholm 7M and one of DeBrusk, Roslovic or Toffoli (5M)

 

 

Nope. Joshua is big, tough, PKs, is fast, and can play against top players. Garland is small, slow, and can’t play against top players. PA will move Garland’s cap this off season. A bottom feeder like Buffalo or Seattle will pay up picks for him. 

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Nope. Joshua is big, tough, PKs, is fast, and can play against top players. Garland is small, slow, and can’t play against top players. PA will move Garland’s cap this off season. A bottom feeder like Buffalo or Seattle will pay up picks for him. 

 

Do you have any concerns about regression with DJ?

[Alflives]

1 hour ago, Bob Long said:

 

Do you have any concerns about regression with DJ?

IMHAO if we are wanting the better of these two that guy is DJ. What he brings (when not providing offence) contributes more to winning. Garland is a negative unless in the offensive zone. 

[Bob Long]

3 minutes ago, Alflives said:

IMHAO if we are wanting the better of these two that guy is DJ. What he brings (when not providing offence) contributes more to winning. Garland is a negative unless in the offensive zone. 

 

my dream is we move Garly to CHI for a 2nd.