Vaccine thread

[Gurn]

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/health/other/this-pediatrician-has-a-stark-warning-about-the-risks-of-anti-science/ar-AA1gVA74?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=bf53ce47b7404ffa843df6752b919bd3&ei=33

"

Apediatrician, author and co-inventor of a low-cost COVID-19 vaccine warns that the anti-vaccine movement has morphed into a political force that threatens the world's gains against deadly childhood infections like measles.

Dr. Peter Hotez, author of the new book The Deadly Rise of Anti-Science: A Scientist's Warning, says the movement is well organized, well financed and includes powerful organizations in the U.S. such as the Republicans' House Freedom Caucus, certain senators and what he calls "contrarian-" and "pseudo-intellectuals."

Some are now looking to target routine childhood and adult immunizations, he told White Coat, Black Art host Dr. Brian Goldman.

"We could … reverse all of the successes we've had in the last two decades around measles immunization or whooping cough," he said. "I'm worried about that."

Hotez says his previous book, 2018's Vaccine Did Not Cause Rachel's Autism, on the genetic roots of his adult daughter's neurodivergence, made him "Public Enemy Number One or Two" with a couple of anti-vaccine groups, which have long made debunked claims that vaccines cause autism.

More recently, he and Maria Elena Bottazzi, who are both co-directors of the Texas Children's Hospital Center for Vaccine Development, were co-nominated for last year's Nobel Peace Prize for their work developing Corbevax, a cheap vaccine to protect people from severe effects of COVID-19. It's already reached 100 million people in places such as in India, he said. 

He says he's been stalked at home and confronted outside a public talk, in addition to getting online threats.

The long-simmering yet mostly fringe resistance to vaccines became more politicized amid the COVID-19 pandemic, when adherents rallied around concepts of health or medical freedom, fanned by extremists on the far right such as the Proud Boys. 

The increasing hostility of what Hotez calls the "anti-science" movement worries him.

"They don't leave a lot of information in their emails when they say 'the army of patriots' is coming to hunt me down," he said of his most extreme critics. "But the nature of the attacks, in terms of its political references, leads me to think that a lot of it are based in extremism on the far right and their adherents." 

In the dedication of his latest book, Hotez lists law enforcement agencies helping to protect him, such as the Houston Police Department and security at his hospital. 

Hotez writes that the movement is globalizing beyond the U.S., including events like last year's trucker convoy in Canada.

"There's no question that the U.S. anti-vaccine movement made an effort to pile on and to exacerbate what was happening in Canada," he said in an interview. 

But Maya Goldenberg, a professor of philosophy at the University of Guelph, views the anti-vaccine sentiment differently. 

"I don't think it's anti-science," said Goldenberg, author of Vaccine Hesitancy: Public Trust, Expertise, and the War on Science. "I think it is some mistrust of scientific institutions and the power that scientific institutions wield."

Building trust with patients

During the rush of the COVID emergency, governments perhaps missed demonstrating how they work in the public interest, which may have fuelled vaccine hesitancy, she says. Amid the lockdowns and other restrictions, for instance, some small business owners felt governments considered their interests "disposable," at least temporarily. 

"We need more unity to deal with difficult circumstances," she said. "We don't get it when people think that the powerful get to decide and regular people are harmed by those decisions."

What helps change the behaviour of vaccine-hesitant parents? Building their trust. 

Dr. Cora Constantinescu runs a vaccine hesitancy clinic for families at the University of Calgary. The pediatric infectious disease physician has witnessed first hand how public information campaigns don't actually change behaviour among those parents.

They needed to feel supported rather than judged or discriminated against, Constantinescu says.

"When we ask them what can build trust in governments and health agencies, our vaccine-hesitant parents said seeing frontline health-care providers being involved in the policy decisions," she said. "I don't think that that has improved."

Every clinician, whether a physician, nurse or lab technologist drawing your blood, has a chance to build positive interactions with their patient. Over time, those encounters foster trust, she says. 

But in Hotez's view, it will take more than one-on-one, personal interactions to counter the political reach of the anti-vaccination movement. He says he suggested to Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus — director-general of the World Health Organization — that the UN agency bring in other experts, like those who counter global terrorism, nuclear proliferation or cyberattacks.

The movement "is really destroying the fabric of society," Hotez said.

[Warhippy]

2 minutes ago, Gurn said:

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/health/other/this-pediatrician-has-a-stark-warning-about-the-risks-of-anti-science/ar-AA1gVA74?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531&cvid=bf53ce47b7404ffa843df6752b919bd3&ei=33

"

Apediatrician, author and co-inventor of a low-cost COVID-19 vaccine warns that the anti-vaccine movement has morphed into a political force that threatens the world's gains against deadly childhood infections like measles.

Dr. Peter Hotez, author of the new book The Deadly Rise of Anti-Science: A Scientist's Warning, says the movement is well organized, well financed and includes powerful organizations in the U.S. such as the Republicans' House Freedom Caucus, certain senators and what he calls "contrarian-" and "pseudo-intellectuals."

Some are now looking to target routine childhood and adult immunizations, he told White Coat, Black Art host Dr. Brian Goldman.

"We could … reverse all of the successes we've had in the last two decades around measles immunization or whooping cough," he said. "I'm worried about that."

Hotez says his previous book, 2018's Vaccine Did Not Cause Rachel's Autism, on the genetic roots of his adult daughter's neurodivergence, made him "Public Enemy Number One or Two" with a couple of anti-vaccine groups, which have long made debunked claims that vaccines cause autism.

More recently, he and Maria Elena Bottazzi, who are both co-directors of the Texas Children's Hospital Center for Vaccine Development, were co-nominated for last year's Nobel Peace Prize for their work developing Corbevax, a cheap vaccine to protect people from severe effects of COVID-19. It's already reached 100 million people in places such as in India, he said. 

He says he's been stalked at home and confronted outside a public talk, in addition to getting online threats.

The long-simmering yet mostly fringe resistance to vaccines became more politicized amid the COVID-19 pandemic, when adherents rallied around concepts of health or medical freedom, fanned by extremists on the far right such as the Proud Boys. 

The increasing hostility of what Hotez calls the "anti-science" movement worries him.

"They don't leave a lot of information in their emails when they say 'the army of patriots' is coming to hunt me down," he said of his most extreme critics. "But the nature of the attacks, in terms of its political references, leads me to think that a lot of it are based in extremism on the far right and their adherents." 

In the dedication of his latest book, Hotez lists law enforcement agencies helping to protect him, such as the Houston Police Department and security at his hospital. 

Hotez writes that the movement is globalizing beyond the U.S., including events like last year's trucker convoy in Canada.

"There's no question that the U.S. anti-vaccine movement made an effort to pile on and to exacerbate what was happening in Canada," he said in an interview. 

But Maya Goldenberg, a professor of philosophy at the University of Guelph, views the anti-vaccine sentiment differently. 

"I don't think it's anti-science," said Goldenberg, author of Vaccine Hesitancy: Public Trust, Expertise, and the War on Science. "I think it is some mistrust of scientific institutions and the power that scientific institutions wield."

Building trust with patients

During the rush of the COVID emergency, governments perhaps missed demonstrating how they work in the public interest, which may have fuelled vaccine hesitancy, she says. Amid the lockdowns and other restrictions, for instance, some small business owners felt governments considered their interests "disposable," at least temporarily. 

"We need more unity to deal with difficult circumstances," she said. "We don't get it when people think that the powerful get to decide and regular people are harmed by those decisions."

What helps change the behaviour of vaccine-hesitant parents? Building their trust. 

Dr. Cora Constantinescu runs a vaccine hesitancy clinic for families at the University of Calgary. The pediatric infectious disease physician has witnessed first hand how public information campaigns don't actually change behaviour among those parents.

They needed to feel supported rather than judged or discriminated against, Constantinescu says.

"When we ask them what can build trust in governments and health agencies, our vaccine-hesitant parents said seeing frontline health-care providers being involved in the policy decisions," she said. "I don't think that that has improved."

Every clinician, whether a physician, nurse or lab technologist drawing your blood, has a chance to build positive interactions with their patient. Over time, those encounters foster trust, she says. 

But in Hotez's view, it will take more than one-on-one, personal interactions to counter the political reach of the anti-vaccination movement. He says he suggested to Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus — director-general of the World Health Organization — that the UN agency bring in other experts, like those who counter global terrorism, nuclear proliferation or cyberattacks.

The movement "is really destroying the fabric of society," Hotez said.

This is what people get for believing Jenny mcCarthy types over people who have literally dedicated their entire lives to understanding how vaccines work and how they affect the human condition

[MeanSeanBean]

Get your Gord damn vaccines. If you don't want to, go live out in the middle of nowhere with others who don't want to play by the rules of modern society. Don't put other at risk because you've decided you know better then decades of modern medicine after joining a Facebook group. From someone in healthcare, unless there is a legitimate medical reason (there rarely is) it's inexcusable. 

[DrJockitch]

Are we really going to start this mess again?

[Warhippy]

8 minutes ago, DrJockitch said:

Are we really going to start this mess again?

hehehehe all the greats are coming back!

[bishopshodan]

Wife has the rona. 

Again.

 

[Bounce000]

My toddler is vaccinated, someone fight me!

[Cerridwen]

1 hour ago, Bounce000 said:

My toddler is vaccinated, someone fight me!

Well done, Dad!!

[forty9er]

It sucks to get it. I'm as vaccinated as I can be and just recovering day 3 atm. Couldn't get off the couch for a solid 16 hours to start though. It's got a bit of a bite, I get it along with flu shot now it's not a problem until you make it one. Stay healthy all

[the destroyer of worlds]

Might as well post this here.

 

This is an mRNA flu shot.  It looks like it might be available for the 24/25 flu season in the US.  Anything better than the hit or miss flu vaccine wee currently have.  Anyone with at-risk people in their life should be crossing their fingers.

 

https://www.cnbc.com/2023/09/13/moderna-flu-vaccine-shows-promising-phase-three-trial-results.html

Moderna says flu vaccine showed promising results in phase three trial, paving path to approval

• Moderna said its experimental mRNA-based flu vaccine generated a stronger immune response against four strains of the virus than a currently available flu vaccine.
• The late-stage trial results cleared the way for a path to approval in the U.S. 
• The results come as Moderna tries to beef up its pipeline and become a company known for more than its blockbuster mRNA Covid vaccine.

[Lenerdosy]

On 9/19/2023 at 12:51 PM, DrJockitch said:

Are we really going to start this mess again?

[Alflives]

On 9/19/2023 at 2:43 PM, producepusher said:

It sucks to get it. I'm as vaccinated as I can be and just recovering day 3 atm. Couldn't get off the couch for a solid 16 hours to start though. It's got a bit of a bite, I get it along with flu shot now it's not a problem until you make it one. Stay healthy all

Imagine how bad you would have done without being vaccinated? 

[Alflives]

On 9/19/2023 at 12:46 PM, MeanSeanBean said:

Get your Gord damn vaccines. If you don't want to, go live out in the middle of nowhere with others who don't want to play by the rules of modern society. Don't put other at risk because you've decided you know better then decades of modern medicine after joining a Facebook group. From someone in healthcare, unless there is a legitimate medical reason (there rarely is) it's inexcusable. 

Refuse vaccinations and get no public medical help if get sick with something a vaccine would have helped prevent serious illness from occurring. Or just move to Alberta. 

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Refuse vaccinations and get no public medical help if get sick with something a vaccine would have helped prevent serious illness from occurring. Or just move to Alberta. 

 

I agree, but it won't happen that way. Doc's are not keen to start triaging based on personal choices, and our politicians would never have the will to do this.

 

But these folks will test everyone's patience again this winter, when we see "pure bloods" demanding blood products from only unvaccinated people, and then claiming discrimination when they don't get it. 

[moosehead]

I hope to get my next Vax soon. Not sure when it will be available.

 

 

[Sapper]

Covid is exploding again at the moment although thankfully with better outcomes 

 

I'm Double boosted as is everyone in the house and today we all tested positive but only my son has mild.cold symptoms 

 

I can tell.you that knowing that full vaxxed people have much better outcomes with very much lower complications is all that matters In my house today

 

No regrets getting it and thankful to have a higher chance of no complications 

[NotTP]

Stop calling them vaccines, first of all. Polio and Rubella have vaccines. These are therapeutics and hardly even that. 

 

After that, if you want to get them, go ahead. If you don't, no one should care. 

 

Same as masks. 

 

My body, my choice, your body, your choice.

[NotTP]

On 9/24/2023 at 9:27 AM, Bob Long said:

 

I agree, but it won't happen that way. Doc's are not keen to start triaging based on personal choices, and our politicians would never have the will to do this.

 

But these folks will test everyone's patience again this winter, when we see "pure bloods" demanding blood products from only unvaccinated people, and then claiming discrimination when they don't get it. 

It's weird to see "these therapeutics still work" people in the wild. The uptake has shown that no one wants to take them. 

 

It's so bad, they won't even measure who is taking them anymore. 

[The Arrogant Worms]

9 minutes ago, TempletonPeck said:

Stop calling them vaccines, first of all. Polio and Rubella have vaccines. These are therapeutics and hardly even that. 

 

After that, if you want to get them, go ahead. If you don't, no one should care. 

 

Same as masks. 

 

My body, my choice, your body, your choice.

Keep your body away from my choice .

 

Thanks.

[The Arrogant Worms]

12 minutes ago, TempletonPeck said:

Stop calling them vaccines, first of all. Polio and Rubella have vaccines. These are therapeutics and hardly even that. 

 

After that, if you want to get them, go ahead. If you don't, no one should care. 

 

Same as masks. 

 

My body, my choice, your body, your choice.

 

No it is a Vaccine.

 

This is the therapeutics treatments....

 

http://www.bccdc.ca/Health-Professionals-Site/Documents/COVID-treatment/ClinicalPracticeGuide_Therapeutics_MildModerateCOVID.pdf

[JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo]

44 minutes ago, TempletonPeck said:

Stop calling them vaccines, first of all. Polio and Rubella have vaccines. These are therapeutics and hardly even that. 

 

After that, if you want to get them, go ahead. If you don't, no one should care. 

 

Same as masks. 

 

My body, my choice, your body, your choice.

Wow, are you the former mod templeton peck, or did you just steal his name? 

[Johngould21]

My brother in law tested positive, two days ago. As we were all traveling together, and I had a bit of a cold and runny nose, I tested as well. Negative! Expect to get our 7th shot in November, along with our annual flu shot.

[Jester13]

On 9/19/2023 at 2:08 PM, Bounce000 said:

My toddler is vaccinated, someone fight me!

Run roh, looks like she won't be able to have children!

[The Arrogant Worms]

7 minutes ago, JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo said:

Wow, are you the former mod templeton peck, or did you just steal his name? 

 

I am guessing a new troll.

[Sharpshooter]

28 minutes ago, JoeyJoeJoeJr. Shabadoo said:

Wow, are you the former mod templeton peck, or did you just steal his name? 

 

It might be him or might not be. 
 

I’ll look into it.