Elias Pettersson Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 In watching the Winnipeg game, it is clear that we need more size up front. Someone that can play up and down the lineup and be a key factor in the playoffs. We had Raffi Torres in 2011, Sergio Momesso in 1994. Joshua is a nice player and is big and strong, but he is not as "intimidating" as I would like. We need a guy who can strike fear into the opponents and need to keep their heads up at every turn. Jack McBain is that player. He plays centre and wing, is 6'4" 218 pounds, can fight with the heavyweights (fought Jarred Tinordi twice and also Adam Lowry). He is currently centering the top line in Arizona. He kills penalties too. He can play up and down the lineup, but I would try him on Petey's wing and see what happens. Move Hoglander to the Miller line. McBain is only 24 years old and has only played 3 years in the NHL after coming from 4 years of NCAA hockey. He has yet to reach his true potential IMO... To Vancouver: Jack McBain To Arizona: Phil DiGiuseppe Linus Karlsson 2025 2nd round pick How Jack McBain Emerged as Coyotes' top Center - The Hockey News Arizona Coyotes News, Analysis and More Why Jack McBain's Absence is Being Overlooked - The Hockey News Arizona Coyotes News, Analysis and More 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted February 18 Author Share Posted February 18 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 (edited) Great target. Also good examples. We need more grit and energy to match our skill (forward group, this year anyways. they've done an incredible job with the D-corp). The player is at the right age too. Everything we do next, should be done with the next four post seasons in mind. Edited February 18 by IBatch 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil_314 Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 I hope Allvin can poach him, and that price is more than reasonable IMO for a 24 year old with only $1.6 million in cap hit. If they wish to run Cooley - Bjugstad - Hayton - Kerfoot as the #1-#4 C's in some order I could see them be willing to let him go (Bjugstad/ Crouse already provide the size/ physicality factor, those are a solid group of C's and any of the first 3 could conceivably play #1 C minutes, whereas McBain's only averaging 13 minutes a night). If there's a Coyotes fan in this forum they could probably inform us better on whether he'd be available, but for playoff battles I'd love to go to war with a dude like that on my side. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 38 minutes ago, Phil_314 said: I hope Allvin can poach him, and that price is more than reasonable IMO for a 24 year old with only $1.6 million in cap hit. If they wish to run Cooley - Bjugstad - Hayton - Kerfoot as the #1-#4 C's in some order I could see them be willing to let him go (Bjugstad/ Crouse already provide the size/ physicality factor, those are a solid group of C's and any of the first 3 could conceivably play #1 C minutes, whereas McBain's only averaging 13 minutes a night). If there's a Coyotes fan in this forum they could probably inform us better on whether he'd be available, but for playoff battles I'd love to go to war with a dude like that on my side. I'm sure that we can get him, but the cost won't be reasonable. Look at what Tampa paid for depth grit. Not saying we shouldn't try but it won't be cheap. And maybe that's ok. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coconuts Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 (edited) I think you'd have to do better than that, and by that I mean give Arizona a player who's more likely to help their NHL roster. The price isn't bad, but Arizona already has oodles of picks. They have a whopping 10 second round picks over the next three drafts in fact. They also have 7 third round picks. Neither Phil or Linus probably moves the needle for them a whole lot at the NHL level, and the Coyotes want to be competitive now, and take the step towards being a regularly competitive team. https://www.dailyfaceoff.com/news/arizona-coyotes-not-looking-to-take-on-salary-cap-dumps-in-the-offseason McBain helps them do that more than this package imo. In fact they could actually be buyers sooner than later if they really want to compete, at the deadline, the draft, or during the offseason. They certainly have the pick currency. If the NHL forces a sale they could be good sooner than later. Prime aged talent, talented prospect pool, tons of cap flex (look at who's coming off the books via the injured reserve), and a bushel of draft picks. https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/coyotes Edited February 18 by Coconuts 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Long Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 17 minutes ago, Coconuts said: I think you'd have to do better than that, and by that I mean give Arizona a player who's more likely to help their NHL roster. The price isn't bad, but Arizona already has oodles of picks. They have a whopping 10 second round picks over the next three drafts in fact. They also have 7 third round picks. Neither Phil or Linus probably moves the needle for them a whole lot at the NHL level, and the Coyotes want to be competitive now, and take the step towards being a regularly competitive team. https://www.dailyfaceoff.com/news/arizona-coyotes-not-looking-to-take-on-salary-cap-dumps-in-the-offseason McBain helps them do that more than this package imo. In fact they could actually be buyers sooner than later if they really want to compete, at the deadline, the draft, or during the offseason. They certainly have the pick currency. If the NHL forces a sale they could be good sooner than later. Prime aged talent, talented prospect pool, tons of cap flex (look at who's coming off the books via the injured reserve), and a bushel of draft picks. https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/coyotes the cost control of McBain would be part of the value for us, but I don't see how this would be a "win" on paper. We're overpaying for sure. Is he the "last piece" of the F group that makes it worth it? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Miss Korea Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 Ah - yet another Canadian who opted for college over the CHL and successfully made the jump to pro right away. Everything looks really promising here, but think about this from Arizona's perspective - what's the rush? McBain has been improving his game and his versatility every year, and he's only 23 - there's no reason for them to give up on him that fast. And if they were to give up that fast, you're certainly not offering them anything worth looking at. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coconuts Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 43 minutes ago, Bob Long said: the cost control of McBain would be part of the value for us, but I don't see how this would be a "win" on paper. We're overpaying for sure. Is he the "last piece" of the F group that makes it worth it? I don't know, but I think it'd require more NHL caliber incentive for Arizona to consider it They don't need another 2nd more than McBain, they have several, Phil is a fourth liner at best, and Karlsson is having a good season (and had one last season) he'll also be 25 in November with little NHL level substance to show for it so I question his value and what he actually is Definitely on the older side for a prospect, if not on the cusp of not being a prospect anymore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Artemus Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 2 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said: In watching the Winnipeg game, it is clear that we need more size up front. Someone that can play up and down the lineup and be a key factor in the playoffs. We had Raffi Torres in 2011, Sergio Momesso in 1994. Joshua is a nice player and is big and strong, but he is not as "intimidating" as I would like. We need a guy who can strike fear into the opponents and need to keep their heads up at every turn. Jack McBain is that player. He plays centre and wing, is 6'4" 218 pounds, can fight with the heavyweights (fought Jarred Tinordi twice and also Adam Lowry). He is currently centering the top line in Arizona. He kills penalties too. He can play up and down the lineup, but I would try him on Petey's wing and see what happens. Move Hoglander to the Miller line. McBain is only 24 years old and has only played 3 years in the NHL after coming from 4 years of NCAA hockey. He has yet to reach his true potential IMO... To Vancouver: Jack McBain To Arizona: Phil DiGiuseppe Linus Karlsson 2025 2nd round pick How Jack McBain Emerged as Coyotes' top Center - The Hockey News Arizona Coyotes News, Analysis and More Why Jack McBain's Absence is Being Overlooked - The Hockey News Arizona Coyotes News, Analysis and More Yes, I agree with this sentiment that we need some more size in the forward group. I first noticed McBain last year and thought that he would be a great addition. Unfortunately, I do not believe that this package of PDG, Linus Karlsson and a 2nd would be close to enough. He has become something of that unicorn, similar to Joshua. Big, physical, can score and fight. Not sure what would be required but maybe a top prospect??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasCanuck Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 McBain....wasn't he a cast member on The Simpsons??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasCanuck Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 3 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said: In watching the Winnipeg game, it is clear that we need more size up front. Someone that can play up and down the lineup and be a key factor in the playoffs. We had Raffi Torres in 2011, Sergio Momesso in 1994. Joshua is a nice player and is big and strong, but he is not as "intimidating" as I would like. We need a guy who can strike fear into the opponents and need to keep their heads up at every turn. Jack McBain is that player. He plays centre and wing, is 6'4" 218 pounds, can fight with the heavyweights (fought Jarred Tinordi twice and also Adam Lowry). He is currently centering the top line in Arizona. He kills penalties too. He can play up and down the lineup, but I would try him on Petey's wing and see what happens. Move Hoglander to the Miller line. McBain is only 24 years old and has only played 3 years in the NHL after coming from 4 years of NCAA hockey. He has yet to reach his true potential IMO... To Vancouver: Jack McBain To Arizona: Phil DiGiuseppe Linus Karlsson 2025 2nd round pick How Jack McBain Emerged as Coyotes' top Center - The Hockey News Arizona Coyotes News, Analysis and More Why Jack McBain's Absence is Being Overlooked - The Hockey News Arizona Coyotes News, Analysis and More Not disagreeing with your assessment that Canucks could use more size up front, although we lost last night in the 3rd due to two mistakes. First was Juulsen prioritizing a hit over defensive coverage. I can forgive this because many players get caught up in the heat of the moment, grabbing that next big hit and at the time, both teams were definitely throwing them and there was, probably in his mind, meet them one for one on hitting. On the second 3rd period goal for Winnipeg, our defensive coverage was horrible. Demko is an awesome goalie, but he had no support on that play. Going back to your proposal, Arizona is prospect rich right now, they are going to be a force in the league in 3 - 4 years no matter if they are playing in Arizona or somewhere else. What reason would they possibly have for doing this? The kid is 24 years old, is on a really cap friendly hit, which is exactly what Arizona needs right now. They don't need more high draft picks, their prospect pool is swimming with high end talent. PDG and Karlsson don't give them anything that they actually need and again, they are out of the phase where they are trading players (especially young players) for picks. If you want McBain, in my mind, you're dangling something that fills a position that they don't currently have depth in. They are swimming in LD prospects, they are weak in RD depth, but we aren't parting with Willander, but to force Arizona to make a trade like this, that is likely the type of player that you're using to force their hand. I don't see anything in our pool that would give Arizona incentive to do this. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted February 18 Author Share Posted February 18 26 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said: Not disagreeing with your assessment that Canucks could use more size up front, although we lost last night in the 3rd due to two mistakes. First was Juulsen prioritizing a hit over defensive coverage. I can forgive this because many players get caught up in the heat of the moment, grabbing that next big hit and at the time, both teams were definitely throwing them and there was, probably in his mind, meet them one for one on hitting. On the second 3rd period goal for Winnipeg, our defensive coverage was horrible. Demko is an awesome goalie, but he had no support on that play. Going back to your proposal, Arizona is prospect rich right now, they are going to be a force in the league in 3 - 4 years no matter if they are playing in Arizona or somewhere else. What reason would they possibly have for doing this? The kid is 24 years old, is on a really cap friendly hit, which is exactly what Arizona needs right now. They don't need more high draft picks, their prospect pool is swimming with high end talent. PDG and Karlsson don't give them anything that they actually need and again, they are out of the phase where they are trading players (especially young players) for picks. If you want McBain, in my mind, you're dangling something that fills a position that they don't currently have depth in. They are swimming in LD prospects, they are weak in RD depth, but we aren't parting with Willander, but to force Arizona to make a trade like this, that is likely the type of player that you're using to force their hand. I don't see anything in our pool that would give Arizona incentive to do this. This makes sense. Lekkerimäki and Willander are untouchable. So we have our 2025 1st. Which is what I thought about but thought it was excessive. But if McBain is a long term plan then it might be worth it. The only other prospect that may interest Arizona is Arturs Silovs. If we extend Demko to the Hellebuyck contract then most likely we don’t need Silovs. I guess it depends if Arizona is high on Silovs or not. Like some people have said, Arizona has a boatload of picks. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MatchesMalone Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 (edited) Yeah McBain doesn't make sense for Arizona to move, but what about Lawson Crouse? He's a bit older now. Would take a pretty hefty package to land him though. Edited February 18 by MatchesMalone 1 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasCanuck Posted February 18 Share Posted February 18 2 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said: This makes sense. Lekkerimäki and Willander are untouchable. So we have our 2025 1st. Which is what I thought about but thought it was excessive. But if McBain is a long term plan then it might be worth it. The only other prospect that may interest Arizona is Arturs Silovs. If we extend Demko to the Hellebuyck contract then most likely we don’t need Silovs. I guess it depends if Arizona is high on Silovs or not. Like some people have said, Arizona has a boatload of picks. I think the plan is to have Silovs backup Demko next year. Things are coming to a head in Arizona. If they don't have a solid plan in place to build in the next couple of months, I fully expect that there will be an announcement that the team is moving to Salt Lake. Arizona has been systematically "kicking the can down the road" with selling off higher value contracts and converting them to draft picks. This has been done in the interest of long-term success of the organization while managing team expenses and salaries. If McBain was in the final year as a RFA and looking at a significant increase for next year, Arizona would be ALL OVER THIS idea. They would love converting him back into a high end draft pick which they could either use at the draft or to target other players of interest in other prospect deep organizations. This philosophy will change as soon as their location issue reaches resolution, they will move back into building for the shorter term as their window will IMO, suddenly snap open as soon as there is a concrete plan on where they will be playing. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DownUndaCanuck Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 I've liked McBain for a while now but think he might be part of their rebuild to be fair. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Captain insano Posted February 21 Share Posted February 21 Zack kassian vibes to me, I’ve only watched him play a few games but he put his team short with some dumb penalty’s when I watched, maybe just bad games I caught him but he def doesn’t move the needle after the eye test the few games I did watch, he does produce a lot of energy tho I do give him that Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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