[Proposal] extend Joshua

[Tank]

Every team is looking for the next Tom Wilson.

And Canucks has only one player who is close-- Joshua.

He has a career year, no doubt. But he will back to average 20-30 points a season. A solid bottom 6 we shall not let walk in the summer.

Without him, I can feel we will be pushed around in Playoff.

any other F can protect our key players?

 

2mil x 3 years.

 

 

[Bob Long]

I'm wary of this one. I don't think he's that good that we need to lock him in, and we have Podz waiting to take his spot at half price. We need every cent of cap next season.

[Jess]

I suspect he might try to get closer to $3M with the way he's playing. At $2M, I'd lock him up long term.

[HKSR]

21 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

I suspect he might try to get closer to $3M with the way he's playing. At $2M, I'd lock him up long term.

Maybe he'll take a bit less ($2.5M) if we give him a 6 year term?  Not sure how many bottom 6 guys bet on themselves to try and eek out more money down the road.  Risky game to play.

[Jess]

2 minutes ago, HKSR said:

Maybe he'll take a bit less ($2.5M) if we give him a 6 year term?  Not sure how many bottom 6 guys bet on themselves to try and eek out more money down the road.  Risky game to play.

 

Also risky to lock in for 6 years at that price, but maybe it'd pay off.

[HKSR]

21 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

 

Also risky to lock in for 6 years at that price, but maybe it'd pay off.

I think it's the only way to get the AAV down.  Otherwise I think it'll be in the $3m territory. 

[Tank]

Look at our bottom 6, who can be the 'under your skin' type of player and also can score/protect teammate?

 

Seriously, PA shall address the toughness bottom 6 issue.

 

Garland

Lafferty

Blueger

Suter

Hog

Aman

 

I don't see anyone fit the category.

 

 

 

[Bob Long]

1 hour ago, -AJ- said:

I suspect he might try to get closer to $3M with the way he's playing. At $2M, I'd lock him up long term.

 

I just don't see how we. can afford that. I'm also leery of getting into another Pearson situation. 

[Outsiders]

1 hour ago, -AJ- said:

I suspect he might try to get closer to $3M with the way he's playing. At $2M, I'd lock him up long term.

He's definitely going to be asking for 3-3.5 million and IMO a team will give him that on a 3 or 4 year deal. 

 

 

I'm so torn on this season. This might be our best chance to win with our cap structure. We will have other chances, but this year feels like a run of some sort could happen. Its tough because we have valuable UFA's and my long term outlook tells me we can't just let guys walk for free. That draft capital is just too important to our long term success as a franchise. 

 

Joshua could get us a 2nd 

Lafferty a 3rd 

Cole a 3rd or 4th

Myers a 1st or a 2nd with prospect

DeSmith 2nd 

 

 

Like man those second rounder would allow us to trade our first for another Hronek type deal but for a 2C. 

[KingRaj91]

He'll probably get 3x3 on the open market tbh, and if that happens, I wouldn't match. I think what we may see next year is Garland being traded and Hogs taking his spot on the third line and Podz taking Joshua's spot on that line with Suter at center. Essentially remaking the third line with similar players for a third of the price.

[Bure_Pavel]

No to spending big money on bottom six wingers.

[Tank]

2 hours ago, Outsiders said:

He's definitely going to be asking for 3-3.5 million and IMO a team will give him that on a 3 or 4 year deal. 

 

 

I'm so torn on this season. This might be our best chance to win with our cap structure. We will have other chances, but this year feels like a run of some sort could happen. Its tough because we have valuable UFA's and my long term outlook tells me we can't just let guys walk for free. That draft capital is just too important to our long term success as a franchise. 

 

Joshua could get us a 2nd 

Lafferty a 3rd 

Cole a 3rd or 4th

Myers a 1st or a 2nd with prospect

DeSmith 2nd 

 

 

Like man those second rounder would allow us to trade our first for another Hronek type deal but for a 2C. 

we are adding at TDL. not substracting. I think PA is pursuing to add a top 9 F, a D man, maybe a 3rd goalie for the cup run.

[Bure_Pavel]

4 hours ago, Outsiders said:

He's definitely going to be asking for 3-3.5 million and IMO a team will give him that on a 3 or 4 year deal. 

 

 

I'm so torn on this season. This might be our best chance to win with our cap structure. We will have other chances, but this year feels like a run of some sort could happen. Its tough because we have valuable UFA's and my long term outlook tells me we can't just let guys walk for free. That draft capital is just too important to our long term success as a franchise. 

 

Joshua could get us a 2nd 

Lafferty a 3rd 

Cole a 3rd or 4th

Myers a 1st or a 2nd with prospect

DeSmith 2nd 

 

 

Like man those second rounder would allow us to trade our first for another Hronek type deal but for a 2C. 

Depth pieces can be replaced in free agency for free or for low round picks, you cant sell these guys with where we are in the standings. Top 6 guys or top 4 dmen are a different story. Good teams are constantly losing and adding depth pieces. An example would be Motte who people were wanting to give 2+ million to on a multi year deal, but for the last two years has only made $1.075 million average over the last years even as a UFA. bottom 6 wingers should top out at $2.25 Million in my opinion and term 3 years max 

Edited January 19, 2024 by Bure_Pavel

[KingRaj91]

59 minutes ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Depth pieces can be replaced in free agency for free or for low round picks, you cant sell these guys with where we are in the standings. Top 6 guys or top 4 dmen are a different story. Good teams are constantly losing and adding depth pieces. An example would be Motte who people were wanting to give 2+ million to on a multi year deal, but for the last two years has only made $1.075 million average over the last years even as a UFA. bottom 6 wingers should top out at $2.25 Million in my opinion and term 3 years max 

This. Totally agree.

[Phil_314]

2 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Depth pieces can be replaced in free agency for free or for low round picks, you cant sell these guys with where we are in the standings. Top 6 guys or top 4 dmen are a different story. Good teams are constantly losing and adding depth pieces. An example would be Motte who people were wanting to give 2+ million to on a multi year deal, but for the last two years has only made $1.075 million average over the last years even as a UFA. bottom 6 wingers should top out at $2.25 Million in my opinion and term 3 years max 

Agreed, though I think he's earned that chunk of change above $2 million which you mentioned in this case.  He can play that physical 3rd line LW role that's been important on previous important 3rd lines (e.g. Higgins/ Pearson) so that along with the pugilist role should earn him that bump since he's not just fists like someone like Reaves would be.  Also, typically I do think that depth pieces should be really cheap ($1 million or below) but he and Garland (because we signed him to that deal) would need to be the exceptions (until we can trade Garland).  At their absolute peak of their power, the Lightning had a distinct top-6/ bottom-6 and top-4/ bottom 2 pay structure, and we definitely need to do the same (I'm glad we have taken strides in doing so, e.g. by trading Beauvillier).  The top-6 will make big bucks (Lotto + however the 2nd line looks), then Joshua and Garland get north of $2 million each, and the rest get $1 million or less.  Top-pair D will get around $16 million total, Zadorov maybe $3?  Then whoever is RD 2 hopefully costs less than Myers, and then we see what depth guys win the bottom-pair (maybe 2 ELC guys?).  Regardless, I trust that Allvin would be able to arrive at a prudent, cost-effective deal with Joshua.

[Elias Pettersson]

6 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Depth pieces can be replaced in free agency for free or for low round picks, you cant sell these guys with where we are in the standings. Top 6 guys or top 4 dmen are a different story. Good teams are constantly losing and adding depth pieces. An example would be Motte who people were wanting to give 2+ million to on a multi year deal, but for the last two years has only made $1.075 million average over the last years even as a UFA. bottom 6 wingers should top out at $2.25 Million in my opinion and term 3 years max 

 

Joshua isn’t a depth piece.  He’s basically a light version of Tom Wilson.  He’s on pace for 22 goals and plays a hard physical game to boot.  He is also one of our top penalty killers.  You don’t just let him walk for nothing, there is nobody else in free agency who can replace him.

 

Petey, Hronek and then Joshua are the important pieces to sign.  DeSmith is below them along with Zadorov and Myers.  Blueger and Lafferty are depth pieces than can be replaced and could walk.  Cole will be 35 next year so I don’t have a problem with him walking either if we lock up Zadorov…

[Tank]

tbh, I want to keep Zad 4x 4 Mil. and also Myers 2 x 2.5 mil. Two big towers are soooo important in playoff.  I am afraid our players will get bullied easily without them.

[Reznor]

If he would be willing to accept 2m, I think we sign that and run. 

[Bure_Pavel]

11 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

 

Joshua isn’t a depth piece.  He’s basically a light version of Tom Wilson.  He’s on pace for 22 goals and plays a hard physical game to boot.  He is also one of our top penalty killers.  You don’t just let him walk for nothing, there is nobody else in free agency who can replace him.

 

Petey, Hronek and then Joshua are the important pieces to sign.  DeSmith is below them along with Zadorov and Myers.  Blueger and Lafferty are depth pieces than can be replaced and could walk.  Cole will be 35 next year so I don’t have a problem with him walking either if we lock up Zadorov…

Hes having a career year but two years ago he was in the AHL, he is not Tom Wilson. Last year he had 23 points in 79 games and was a -16. You cant give big contracts based on one year of production when the whole team is firing at the rate they have. If he want to stay and make $2.25 mil X 3 then thats great if he want to chase a big payday in FA that fine too, he can be replaced. 

[Artemus]

19 hours ago, Bure_Pavel said:

Hes having a career year but two years ago he was in the AHL, he is not Tom Wilson. Last year he had 23 points in 79 games and was a -16. You cant give big contracts based on one year of production when the whole team is firing at the rate they have. If he want to stay and make $2.25 mil X 3 then thats great if he want to chase a big payday in FA that fine too, he can be replaced. 

 

You make some solid points and I agree with them.

 

Joshua, at 27 has entered into his peak years with a nice run of play. Theoretically, he should be able to hold this level of play until he is 32. Roughly another 4 years.

So, I think that your contract terms look quite reasonable from a team perspective. To keep the AAV down, I would consider adding an additional year. 4 years rather than 3.

 

With the cap hurt coming from the OEL buyout, we have to be leary of giving any player the Benning contract. A million too much and a year too long.

[DownUndaCanuck]

I'd give him 2M in a heart-beat but if he wants 3M we're in trouble. He has been very good and has really shown some nice hands in a lot of his goals, so is partly a product of playing in a good system and with Garland who retrieves pucks well but also he's been great at finishing which not many can do that well. On pace for just about 20G, 40P.

 

He has 16 points in his last 20 games which is pretty nuts.

[Hammertime]

Dakota got his ass beat by 40 yearlod Giordano. I'm not arguing his value but trina go long term because he's some Tom Wilson is laughable. I'd give him 2.5m x 2 I think he's earned it and need's to continue to have the carrot and the stick.   

[bishopshodan]

7 minutes ago, Hammertime said:

Dakota got his ass beat by 40 yearlod Giordano. I'm not arguing his value but trina go long term because he's some Tom Wilson is laughable. I'd give him 2.5m x 2 I think he's earned it and need's to continue to have the carrot and the stick.   

Showing up is all that matters. He also didn't get his 'ass beat'. He 'lost' a hockey fight. He ate Gio's big shot without issue, very tough, it didn't look good but Joshua was still fine and could have continued fighting. If I am fighting a dude that eats my big punches like candy, I get nervous pretty quick. 

 

Dakota has indomitable spirit  ( probably why Tocc took to him so quick)and is showing something in his hands more important than pugilism these days. He's potting a few timely goals and a big part of a great line. 

[bh90]

I think on open market Dakota could fetch 3 to 3.5 million from someone... especially when you have young, low cap teams like the Blackhawks who would be willing to pay extra on a short-term deal to bring some toughness and experience to a young core.

 

Howeve, before this year Joshua hasn't been able to carve out an impact role in the NHL and he will be 28 next year. He has spent majority of his NHL career riding the press box or AHL.

 

You look at these type of guys historically in the NHL and they tend to take discounts and/or short term deals to be on a winning/competitive team. 

 

Considering how uneventful his pro career has been prior to this year... you can see the joy and happiness in his eyes and attitude this year. I think he's the type of guy who may take a discount.... same with Blueger.... these 2 guys just want to win.

 

Just my 2 cents.

 

3 x 2.5 is my guess with Canucks 

[Johnny]

I think he is a product of a good system and situation

 

hes 27 and this year is looking to triple his nhl totals from before this season

 

i would offer 1.5milx4, easy enough to bury if needed, gives him longer term security but also isnt too much if his play falls back to his average