[Trade] Canucks Acquire Elias Lindholm from Calgary for Andrei Kuzmenko, Hunter Brzustewicz, Joni Jurmo, 2024 1st and Conditional 2024 4th

[Thrago]

24 minutes ago, Hogs and Podz said:

Yah... Short term, isn't always a bad thing.  Lindholm is helping this team right now... Big time.  In the playoffs. Isn't that what it's all about? 

 

As it currently stands, Calgary will get no better than 24th oa pick.  Without Lindy, we may very well not be in this round and with a win to boot.  

 

You think long term like Buffalo thinks longterm.  Winning cups... On EA. 

For sure the Playoffs is what it's all about, but you can't forget about the future too.  This is the first real year that we have made the playoffs and we dumped a 1st, Kuzy, that defensemen I'll call him B cause I can't remember how to spell his name and potentially a 4th.  If we resign Lindholm that goes a long way to making this better but if not, then what we dump more futures next year before the playoffs and before you know it we have no future and we are looking at another 10 year rebuild.  I'm not apposed to going all in but the timing has to be right, IMO the timing is at least a year too early.

 

I think we should have done a couple smaller moves, seen how we do and maybe make the big push next year, in a bubble this trade isn't so bad, I get that.  It's what it signals in the future that bothers me.  How many more years are we going to trade our first +++ for a push before we are back to 2015 level hockey?  If Lindholm re-signs with us that makes this much better, but the amount of futures we spent on a rental that scares me a bit.  I look at it like this, if you can't afford to go on a big holiday you don't, you go on what you can afford, you don't just go on a big holiday anyways and put it all on a credit card, cause your going to have to pay for it eventually and now it's going to cost you more.  IMO the Canucks couldn't afford it yet, they are close to being able too, but they jumped the gun IMO.  

 

Maybe they win the Cup this year and I'm wrong that's ok, I will be thrilled to be wrong.  There is a time for these types of moves, IMO this just isn't it.  I've been watching this team for over 40 years and while it's fun to go on a nice holiday, the only thing that matters to me anymore is winning the CUP at least once before I die and premature moves like this IMO just put that goal a little farther away.

[Hogs and Podz]

55 minutes ago, Thrago said:

Maybe they win the Cup this year and I'm wrong that's ok, I will be thrilled to be wrong.  There is a time for these types of moves, IMO this just isn't it.  I've been watching this team for over 40 years and while it's fun to go on a nice holiday, the only thing that matters to me anymore is winning the CUP at least once before I die and premature moves like this IMO just put that goal a little farther away.

Okay so... From what I understand, to you, unless we get a cup from these trades, it was a waste?  

 

I believe they got out of a bad decision in cost and to a lesser degree, term in trading Kuzy.  Brew wasn't going to sign anyway... So why not get some value for our prospect.  

 

I'm not saying this was a home run... But I believe it is much to early to judge it at this point.  Let's see how far we go first... Every win, improves the value of this trade. 

Edited May 10 by Hogs and Podz

[HKSR]

2 hours ago, Thrago said:

For sure the Playoffs is what it's all about, but you can't forget about the future too.  This is the first real year that we have made the playoffs and we dumped a 1st, Kuzy, that defensemen I'll call him B cause I can't remember how to spell his name and potentially a 4th.  If we resign Lindholm that goes a long way to making this better but if not, then what we dump more futures next year before the playoffs and before you know it we have no future and we are looking at another 10 year rebuild.  I'm not apposed to going all in but the timing has to be right, IMO the timing is at least a year too early.

 

I think we should have done a couple smaller moves, seen how we do and maybe make the big push next year, in a bubble this trade isn't so bad, I get that.  It's what it signals in the future that bothers me.  How many more years are we going to trade our first +++ for a push before we are back to 2015 level hockey?  If Lindholm re-signs with us that makes this much better, but the amount of futures we spent on a rental that scares me a bit.  I look at it like this, if you can't afford to go on a big holiday you don't, you go on what you can afford, you don't just go on a big holiday anyways and put it all on a credit card, cause your going to have to pay for it eventually and now it's going to cost you more.  IMO the Canucks couldn't afford it yet, they are close to being able too, but they jumped the gun IMO.  

 

Maybe they win the Cup this year and I'm wrong that's ok, I will be thrilled to be wrong.  There is a time for these types of moves, IMO this just isn't it.  I've been watching this team for over 40 years and while it's fun to go on a nice holiday, the only thing that matters to me anymore is winning the CUP at least once before I die and premature moves like this IMO just put that goal a little farther away.

Without Lindholm, I think we would have lost to NAS in 5 games.  There is incredible value for gaining experience in the playoffs by learning how to close out a series. 

 

As of this moment, instead of only 5 games of experience this year, the Canucks will get at LEAST 11 games of experience.  Win this round and there is without a doubt that the trade was worth it as they will get at least 15 games of experience under their belts in one playoff run.  Some teams take 2 to 3 years to get that kind of experience (being knocked out in Round 1 over and over).  Gotta remember this is their first go at this.  They've already done very, very well and they will certainly learn from this run.

 

IMO, this trade has already paid off in terms of gaining valuable experience for the playoffs.  This group NEEDS to gain this experience if they want to become a consistent contender year over year in the near future.  They're already ahead of the curve compared to many teams in terms of building up to a Cup win.

[R3aL]

4 hours ago, HKSR said:

Without Lindholm, I think we would have lost to NAS in 5 games.  There is incredible value for gaining experience in the playoffs by learning how to close out a series. 

 

As of this moment, instead of only 5 games of experience this year, the Canucks will get at LEAST 11 games of experience.  Win this round and there is without a doubt that the trade was worth it as they will get at least 15 games of experience under their belts in one playoff run.  Some teams take 2 to 3 years to get that kind of experience (being knocked out in Round 1 over and over).  Gotta remember this is their first go at this.  They've already done very, very well and they will certainly learn from this run.

 

IMO, this trade has already paid off in terms of gaining valuable experience for the playoffs.  This group NEEDS to gain this experience if they want to become a consistent contender year over year in the near future.  They're already ahead of the curve compared to many teams in terms of building up to a Cup win.

Ya and he seems to keep just getting better.

 

Pretty interesting Dhalli on the morning show saying management looking at extending Lindholm. But off signing Lindholm means no Blueger.

 

If there was a way to trade Hronek and:

 

Sign:

 

Lindholm

Zadorov

Joshua

Tanev + Myers to Discounted hometown deals

 

That would be pretty tremendous work. I dont know how it works $$ wise but they are heavier, playoff type forwards and have really shown their worth to now.

 

So curious how things are gonna go.

[PureQuickness]

I've been a critic of this trade - and I was terribly worried that we'd end up with a trade deadline player who would be a no-show. That clearly isn't Lindholm.

[PureQuickness]

18 minutes ago, R3aL said:

Ya and he seems to keep just getting better.

 

Pretty interesting Dhalli on the morning show saying management looking at extending Lindholm. But off signing Lindholm means no Blueger.

 

If there was a way to trade Hronek and:

 

Sign:

 

Lindholm

Zadorov

Joshua

Tanev + Myers to Discounted hometown deals

 

That would be pretty tremendous work. I dont know how it works $$ wise but they are heavier, playoff type forwards and have really shown their worth to now.

 

So curious how things are gonna go.

 

I think it's two or three at most from that list. Myers likely will stay for a hometown discount, but he deserves the money. He's elevated his game. Not sure if we should re-sign Lindholm, mostly because we have other players we need to sign and we have no cap space.

 

I think Hronek should be traded though. I'm sure we can find someone in UFA who can take his spot. Nothing against the guy, but if he's asking for 8M, that is a hard pass.

[Coconuts]

Probs cheesed that whatshisname couldn't keep him in Vancouver 

 

 

 

[D.B Cooper]

Worth it. 

[Coryberg]

Anyone have a problem with this trade now? The haters have gone hella quiet these days.

[Junkyard Dog]

Re-sign him.

 

Trade Mikheyev. 

[NHL97OneTimer]

1 hour ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Re-sign him.

 

Trade Mikheyev. 

It's trickier than that.  EP gets a huge raise and now they have to try and bring back EL, JD, PH and the big Z.....and others.  Trading Mikheyev is not a given, but it's the easiest decision.  

[NHL97OneTimer]

On 5/10/2024 at 2:04 PM, R3aL said:

Ya and he seems to keep just getting better.

 

Pretty interesting Dhalli on the morning show saying management looking at extending Lindholm. But off signing Lindholm means no Blueger.

 

If there was a way to trade Hronek and:

 

Sign:

 

Lindholm

Zadorov

Joshua

Tanev + Myers to Discounted hometown deals

 

That would be pretty tremendous work. I dont know how it works $$ wise but they are heavier, playoff type forwards and have really shown their worth to now.

 

So curious how things are gonna go.

Zadorov and Joshua have to be resigned for sure.  Would be really good to keep Lindholm and Hronek.  

 

Here's the $93M question though......if Lindholm, Zadorov, Hronek, Joshua and others are willing to come back with a reasonable contract, do you consider trading EP?  Feels crazy to type this, but these playoffs are showing how this team wins in the playoffs and it's not the style EP is playing.  If we could fetch a solid return and keep the rest of the team together (more or less), do you not consider it?  I just don't see how they build a winner with EP's contract and OEL's penalty.  I'd rather have a team than an individual taking almost 150% of the salary of Miller but with 50% of the heart of Miller. 

 

Flame away, but the collective of this team is meaningful and what I heard on the tele is that this is a team, not a group of guys......they're actually playing for each other and having fun.  I really love EP on this team, but man it's not good for him or the city if they can't put together a winner because of that huge contract......unless he can take the team on his back and single-handedly bring them to the cup finals.  It's proving difficult for McDavid over the years, so why do we think EP can do it?

Edited May 13 by NHL97OneTimer

[N4ZZY]

5 hours ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Re-sign him.

 

Trade Mikheyev. 

He definitely has to go. He's not doing anything to help Petey; he's a black hole for offense. 

 

[N4ZZY]

4 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

Zadorov and Joshua have to be resigned for sure.  Would be really good to keep Lindholm and Hronek.  

 

Here's the $93M question though......if Lindholm, Zadorov, Hronek, Joshua and others are willing to come back with a reasonable contract, do you consider trading EP?  Feels crazy to type this, but these playoffs are showing how this team wins in the playoffs and it's not the style EP is playing.  If we could fetch a solid return and keep the rest of the team together (more or less), do you not consider it?  I just don't see how they build a winner with EP's contract and OEL's penalty.  I'd rather have a team than an individual taking almost 150% of the salary of Miller but with 50% of the heart of Miller. 

 

Flame away, but the collective of this team is meaningful and what I heard on the tele is that this is a team, not a group of guys......they're actually playing for each other and having fun.  I really love EP on this team, but man it's not good for him or the city if they can't put together a winner because of that huge contract......unless he can take the team on his back and single-handedly bring them to the cup finals.  It's proving difficult for McDavid over the years, so why do we think EP can do it?

I think as the cap rises, management will surround him with a better team. I trust Allvin and Rutherford to do the right things, and the good work. 

 

And no, I don't think we should trade Petey. This is, his second time making the playoffs if you include the Bubble playoffs? 

 

Hughes is going to cost more than Petey does eventually. 

 

[N4ZZY]

4 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

It's trickier than that.  EP gets a huge raise and now they have to try and bring back EL, JD, PH and the big Z.....and others.  Trading Mikheyev is not a given, but it's the easiest decision.  

I wonder if any of those guys that are becoming UFA's will take a hometown discount to stay with a potential contender in Van. 

 

[Alflives]

8 hours ago, Coryberg said:

Anyone have a problem with this trade now? The haters have gone hella quiet these days.

Exactly! The moran crowd is no where to be found now. 

[The Lock]

On 5/10/2024 at 4:54 AM, Thrago said:

Not really your just thinking short term, I have no problem with Lindholm he's a good player, we just paid way to much for him and it's going to hurt us in the long-term and possibly really badly.

 

Dude. Cope much? You need to ask yourself if you are just coming up with excuses in the end.

 

Perhaps they didn't do what you wanted. Perhaps Lindholm hasn't done what you wanted. However, denying he hasn't been doing what we got him to do at this point (ie. help us in the playoffs) is just silly at best.

 

This whole long term/short term idea when it comes to this, it really doesn't matter when the entire point of the trade was about this year. It's very clear we're not going to resign everyone, likely not Lindholm, but that wasn't the point of the trade. Look at teams like Tampa Bay and how they acquire short term players. Same with Vegas. Same with almost any team looking to win the actual cup. You want a good team to win the cup? Then you can't just stay stagnant because you're paranoid of the long term.

 

And I can understand if you're not used to this. We haven't had a management team actually be like this for a long time... if ever.

Edited May 13 by The Lock

[VegasCanuck]

If we can do it without breaking the bank, I would re-sign him.

[flickyoursedin]

Sign Joshua, Zadarov, Lindholm and Hronek! To make it all work you trade away Mikheyev and start working some Vegas LTIR magic with holding some players out to make it all work!

[DrJockitch]

If moving Hronek and Mik means we can sign Dak, Zads and this guy then it is worth it.

We can find wingers, just not sure where the rest of the D will come from but PA pulls off miracles on the regular.

Problem is he is the perfect third line centre for us but wants first line money.

 

Edited May 13 by DrJockitch

[NHL97OneTimer]

7 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

I think as the cap rises, management will surround him with a better team. I trust Allvin and Rutherford to do the right things, and the good work. 

 

And no, I don't think we should trade Petey. This is, his second time making the playoffs if you include the Bubble playoffs? 

 

Hughes is going to cost more than Petey does eventually. 

 

...and right now Hughes is the more valuable player.  I do hope they can make this work with EP on the team.  He does need 2 better linemates.  But he also looks a bit lost and shy to get in the mix.  The fear of course is that he's a regular season player and we all know the game changes in the playoffs to a more physical battle.....but you need guys like EP just to get to the dance I suppose.  If it weren't for his salary, I'd have zero concerns with him. 

 

I've said the same about McDavid, Mathews, etc.  Great players who deserve the money but it's just tough to build a contender with large rich contracts like that in a cap world.  2 solid players at $7M/yr can be more effective than two players at $11M/yr & $3M/yr I think.

[Junkyard Dog]

18 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

It's trickier than that.  EP gets a huge raise and now they have to try and bring back EL, JD, PH and the big Z.....and others.  Trading Mikheyev is not a given, but it's the easiest decision.  

 

I know I am willing to make sacrifices with picks to move him. I don't think we can afford to take any significant step back. Having 3 good Cs puts us at a significant advantage over most teams.

 

An argument could be made though with upgrading the blueline over that. 

[Junkyard Dog]

14 hours ago, N4ZZY said:

He definitely has to go. He's not doing anything to help Petey; he's a black hole for offense. 

 

 

Hasn't found his game since his knee injury. We are not in a position to wait for him to figure it out. I like him when he's on his game but it hasn't been the case for quite a bit and upgrades and retention of players is needed. 

[Guntrix]

22 hours ago, NHL97OneTimer said:

It's trickier than that.  EP gets a huge raise and now they have to try and bring back EL, JD, PH and the big Z.....and others.  Trading Mikheyev is not a given, but it's the easiest decision.  

That's precisely the problem. The need to trade Mikheyev is so obvious that teams are going to make it cost us dearly. 

 

I'll throw a more controversial one out there. Trade Pettersson. With 11.6 million we get 2-3 very good players. Unfortunately, no team will be able to take on that mammoth contract without sending some cap back in return. 

[J-23]

12 hours ago, DrJockitch said:

If moving Hronek and Mik means we can sign Dak, Zads and this guy then it is worth it.

We can find wingers, just not sure where the rest of the D will come from but PA pulls off miracles on the regular.

Problem is he is the perfect third line centre for us but wants first line money.

 

 

If you trade both of those guys then you can sign Lindholm, Zadorov and Joshua.

 

Also a lot of good RHD in UFA this season, Pesce, Roy and Tanev. 

 

I would just run Lindholm with Miller and Boeser next season. Then closer to playoff time we can always run 3 centres down the middle to balance out the lines if needed.